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[인터뷰 번역] A$AP Rocky와 옥스퍼드 학생들의 대화
 
  3009
2020-08-20 19:13:15


*대본 작성을 목적으로 진행되어 위 인터뷰 영상과 100% 일치하지 않습니다.

*The interview has been modified for documentation purposes.


소개

Introduction


에이셉 라키: 안녕하세요, 다들 기분 어떠세요? 좋아요. 오늘 와주셔서 감사해요. 저는 오늘 강의를 하려고 온 게 아니라 여러분과 대화를 하러 왔어요. 다들 준비 되셨길 바래요, 저는 대화를 나누기 위해 왔으니까. 오늘의 주제는 아티스트 개발부터 2015년도, 그리고 독립적인 아티스트가 되는 방법에 대해 얘기해 보려 해요. 사람들은 이제 큰 음반 제작사의 도움 없이 유명세를 얻을 수 있어요. 라디오의 도움도 필요 없이. 대신 지금 세상에서 가장 큰 플랫폼인 인터넷이 필요하죠. 저 같이 아무 경험 없는 사람들이 재능을 보여줄 수 있는 플랫폼이에요. 예를 들면, 저는 할렘에서 시작한 크루 A$AP을 2007년도에 합류했어요. 그 당시에는 그저 유치한 것들을 하고 싶어 하는 10대의 모임일 뿐이었죠. 어떤 유치한 것들을 말하는지는 더 설명 안 해도 다들 아시죠? 그리고 그런 것들은 결국 저희를 아무 데도 데려다주지 않았어요. 그냥 일어나서 즐거운 여름을 보내고, 이뤄낸 것 하나 없이, 돈도, 직업도 없이 살고 있었으니까요. 어느 날 저는 주변을 둘러보면서 이렇게 얘기했어요, “우리 뭐라도 해야 해, 서로를 활용해야 해.” 그때 가장 중요했던 건 조금 뻔할 수도 있는 것들을 다시 한번 생각해 보는 거였어요. 일반 상식을 포함해서 말이에요, 왜냐면 상식적인 걸 이해 못 하는 사람들이 얼마나 많은지 알면 다들 놀랄 거예요. 그래서 저의 상식적인 생각들은 저를 인터넷으로 이끌었고, 인터넷을 이용해서 제 자신을 홍보하고 저만의 브랜드를 세상에 보여줄 수 있게 되었어요. 아티스트가 되고 싶은 사람들에게 꼭 말해주고 싶은데, 이제는 브랜드나 회사를 홍보하는 방식을 똑같이 자기 자신에게 적용해야 해요. 이제 더 이상 브랜드라는 것은 한 회사를 가리키는 말이 아닌, 한 사람에게도 적용되는 단어에요. 예를 들자면, 실제로 그럴 일은 없겠지만 지금 에이셉 라키가 나가서 몇백 명의 사람들을 총으로 쏜다고 가정해봅시다. 그렇다면 저라는 브랜드가 엉망이 되겠죠. 저는 오늘 이런 얘기들을 하러 왔어요. 저는 지금까지 얻은 모든 것들을 위해 죽을 만큼 노력해야 했다고 당당하게 말할 수 있어요. 그래서 오늘 이 자리에 있는 것도 저에게는 너무나 큰 영광입니다. 여러분은 이 학교에 다니시지만, 저는 이 자리에서 얘기를 하고 있다는 것만으로도 꿈을 이룬 것 같아요. 

What’s up guys? How you guys doing? Cool, cool. Feeling good? I want to thank everybody for attending today. This isn’t a lecture from me, it’s just a conversation with people and opinions. And I hope you guys are ready because that’s what I came for today. The topic of this discussion: artist development, 2015, how to be independent as an artist because obviously I think the cat is out the bag. People know you don’t need a big record label anymore to get exposure, you don’t need radio; you need the biggest platform on the planet right now, which is the internet. People such as myself with no kind of experience, it gives us a platform to showcase our talent. For instance, when I started A$AP, I joined in 2007, it’s a crew from Harlem. It was just a bunch of teenage kids that wanted to do teenage things. I don’t think I have to specify at this point, right? Basically, that leads to nothing because you just wake up and you spend most of summer having fun, you don’t have anything accomplished, you don’t have any money, you don’t have a job, nothing. I looked around and I said “we gotta do something about this, we need to utilize each other.” I think the main part is identifying and stating the obvious. Like common sense. You’d be surprised how many people lacked it. I used my common sense, and it led me to use internet as an outlet to market myself, to get my brand out there. For those of you trying to be artists, the ways that you would market a brand or a corporation is the same way you have to market yourself these days. Because a brand is no longer just a company, it can be an individual. For instance, if A$AP Rocky goes out and, this would never happen, but shoots a 100 people, it would mess up my brand. It would mess up my brand as a person. I came here today to talk about that. I’m speaking for myself when I say I had to work really hard for anything I ever got. Even being here is a big honor. I know you guys attend here, but even talking here is a dream-come-true.


Q: 어떤 평론가들은 이번  앨범이 당신이 평소에 사용하던 힙합의 기준에서 조금 벗어난다고 해요이거에 대해 어떻게 생각하세요?

On your new album, some critics have commented that it is a bit of a move away from your standard of hip hop. How would you respond to that? 


에이셉 라키: 바뀐 거죠. 당신도 2011년도에 갖고 있던 마인드가 지금의 마인드와 같지 않을 거라고 생각해요. 날이 지나면서 우리 모두 바뀌는 거고, 시간이 모든 걸 바꾸죠. 저는 제 전체적인 스타일을 버리지 않고 대중적인 히트를 만들 수 있다는 걸 증명하고 싶었어요. 왜냐면 대부분 라디오에 자기 자신을 맞추잖아요, 당연히 그게 잘 팔리는 음악이니까. 하지만 그 기준에서 벗어나 다른 길을 택하면 큰 위험도 따르게 되는 것 같아요. 그래서 처음 믹스테이프로부터 2년 후에 이 앨범이 나왔을 때, 제가 언더그라운드의 왕에서부터 대중적인 미디어에서도 한자리를 차지할 수 있다고 증명하고 싶었어요. 2년 정도 쉬면서 인스트루멘털 앨범도 만들고, 연기, 그리고 패션에 발을 담가보면서 이 앨범이 나온 지금은 그냥 상관 안 하는 것 같아요. 이게 대중에게 좋게 들리면 다행인 거고, 아니면 마는 거죠. 어찌 되던 상업적인 음반을 내고 싶진 않았어요. 

It’s changed. I don’t think that the mind state that you had in 2011 is the same mind state that you have now. We all change with the days, time changes it all. I wanted to prove to people that I could make a mainstream hit without comprising my whole style or what not because most people just try to fit into radio or whatever it going on because that's what sells, obviously. When you take the initiative to go left, it's taking a big risk, so when I came out initially it was a mixtape. When I came out with the album two years later, I wanted to prove I could go from underground mixtape king to having a place in mainstream media. I took about two years off and started making instrumental albums, acting, getting into fashion, and I felt with this album I didn't care. If it came out and it was appealing to mainstream, it’s fine, but I didn’t want anything that sounded commercial.

 

[At. Long. Last. ASAP (2015)]:


Q:  기간 동안 아티스트적인 통제력은 어떻게 유지하셨나요?

How did you maintain your artistic control?


에이셉 라키: 제 자신을 분리 시켜야 했죠. 런던에 왔고, 앨범 전체를 영국에서 녹음했어요. 제가 같이 작업하고 싶은 사람들에게 전화를 걸면서. M.I.A와 항상 작업해보고 싶었는데, 이 앨범에 참여 안한 스켑타와 다른 그라임 아티스트들도 그냥 옆에서 함께 하는 거만으로도 좋은 에너지를 많이 받았고 서로 시너지도 너무 좋았어요. 제 노래가 대중에게 어떤 식으로 보이고 어떻게 받아들여지는지는 중요하지 않았던 것 같아요. 왜냐면 제 전 앨범에 있던 Problems와 Wild 같은 곡들을 보고 같이 콜라보 하고 싶다는 연락이 많이 왔었어요. 근데 작업 요청이 왔던 노래들 다 너무 별로였죠. 그런 노래는 하고 싶지 않았는데, 그런 요청들이 들어오는 건 제가 그런 스타일의 노래를 냈었기 때문이니까 누군가를 원망할 수도, 화를 낼 수도 없었어요. 이 앨범으로는 그저 제 자신에 대해 얘기하고 표현하고 싶었어요. 이게 정말 저예요.

I had to isolate myself, I came to London, I recorded the whole thing in the UK. I would just call in people I wanted to work with. I wanted M.I.A, but also people who weren't even on the album was around like Skepta, and other grime artists, just to have them around for the energy, there was a lot of synergy. It wasn’t really about how I wanted to put my songs out or how they would be perceived. Because from my last album, people just saw me from 'Problems' and 'Wild' and I got collaboration requests for songs that were just awful. I didn't wanna be a part of it, but offers were coming in because that's what I had put out there, that was the impression. So I couldn't be mad. With this album, I just wanted to articulate myself and express myself. That’s who I am.

 

[F**kin' Problems]:

 

[Wild For The Night]: 

 

Q: 이번 앨범에 L$D (LOVE x $EX x DREAMS)라는 트랙이 있어요창작 과정에서 이렇게 다른 방식의 영향을 받는  어떤지에 대해 말씀해 주세요.  

You’ve got a track on your album called L$D (LOVE x $EX x DREAMS). Maybe you could talk about what it’s like to be influenced under the creative process. 


에이셉 라키: 사랑, 섹스, 그리고 꿈을 LSD에 대한 은유로 표현한 곡이에요. 대충 여성을 마약에 비유하는 내용이에요, 왜냐면 저는 여자가 세상에서 제일 중독적인 거 같거든요, 진지하게. 그냥 그 두 개의 주제를 연결하고 한 번에 얘기하고 싶었어요. 저는 이제 26살인데, 다른 전형적인 “래퍼”들과 다른 시각에서 인생을 바라봐요. 저에게 인생이란 진동과 케미스트리, 그리고 긍정 혹은 부정적인 에너지예요. 저는 그 어떤 의도보다 에너지가 훨씬 더 강하다고 생각해요. 그런 느낌들을 제 음악을 통해 표현하고 싶었어요. 무엇보다 당신들이 내 음악을 들을 때 어떠한 방식으로든, 슬퍼지든 기뻐지든, 아니면 바로 꺼버리고 싶더라도 그 어떤 감각이라도 느끼길 바라요. 아무 감정 없이 듣는 거 말고 감정을 이끌어내고 싶었어요. L$D에서처럼 그렇게 노래해 본 적 없는 거 같아요, 이 노래를 만들 때 정말 LSD에 취해있었는지 기억이 나진 않지만, 미친 록스타처럼 들리긴 해요.

Love, sex, dreams is a metaphor for LSD. Basically, I talk about how women can be referenced to as a drug, because for me, a female’s vagina is the most addictive thing in the world, all jokes aside. Seriously though, I just wanted to make a song that kind of related to both and touch on both subjects. I’m 26, I look at life through a different point of view than most typical “rappers.” For me, life is all about vibrations and chemistry, and all about positive vibes and negative vibes. I think energy is stronger than intentions. I wanted to manifest those vibes on my music, I wanted you people to hear my music and feel a certain way, a sensation, even if it made you sad or happy, lifted you, or even if you wanted to turn that shit right the fuck off, I wanted you to feel something. I didn’t want you to be bland, I wanted to drive emotion. With L$D, I’ve never sung like that before, I was singing the whole time. I can’t remember if I was on LSD at that time, but I sound really crazy like a ghetto rockstar. 

 

[L$D (LOVE x $EX x DREAMS)]: 

 

Q: 그리고 그때 어머니와는 무슨 일이 있었는지 얘기해 주실  있나요?

And what happened with your mom?


에이셉 라키: 양심에 찔려서 피하고 싶은 질문이었는데 어쩔 수 없네요. 제가 틀린 걸 수도 있는데 여러분은 옥스퍼드 학생들이니까 말해주세요. 아인슈타인도 LSD를 사용하지 않았었나요? 인터넷 찾아보세요. 아인슈타인.

I tried to avoid that. So you know, I felt guilty. Correct me if I’m wrong because you guys are Oxford students, isn’t it true that Einstein did LSD? Look it up. Einstein. 


Q: 많은 사람들이 많은 마약을 했었죠

A lot of people did a lot of drugs.


에이셉 라키: 어디에서 읽었는데, 그걸 견딜 수 있으면 창의적인 천재래요. 저는 그걸 사용했을 때 다 기억났거든요. 어쨌든 제 어머니에게 말하기 조금 무서웠는데, “엄마, 나 마약 했어. 자백할게”라고 했었어요. 이렇게 부모님과 가까운 사이를 유지하고 있는 사람 있나요? 많은 부모님들은 이 정도로 개방적인 사람들이 아니라는 걸 알아요, 되게 불공평한 거이긴 한데 그래도 얘기를 나눌 수 있는 친구라도 있길 바라요. 저는 제 어머니한테 말할 수밖에 없었어요. 근데 “아, 괜찮아 아가야, 나도 어릴 때 다 했어”라는 반응이셨죠. 그래서 그 이후로 저는 제 어머니와 더욱더 가까워졌고 아직도 너무 친해요. 제 어머니 너무 멋있으세요.

I read this thing where it says if you can endure it, you’re some kind of a creative genius. When I came out of it, I remembered everything. I told my mom like “Ma, I did drugs, I gotta confess.” I was a little scared to tell her. Anybody got a close relationship with their parents like that, that you could tell them anything? A lot of people’s parents aren’t that open-minded which is not fair, so hopefully you guys got a best friend or somebody to talk to about that stuff. For me, I had to tell my mom. She was like “Aw, that’s okay babe, I did it in my days.” So that pulled me and my mom closer together. We’re so tight. My mom is so cool.


Q: 앨범에  번째 트랙인 Holy Ghost 되게 재밌게 들었어요종교적인 얘기들이 많이 포함되어 있는데당신과 신의 관계가 어떤 영향을 주는지 궁금해요당신이 느끼는 거라든지 지금의 위치아님 당신의 라이프스타일과 많이 반대되나요

I was really interested to see the first track on your album, Holy Ghost. It had a lot about your religious reflections. I wanted to know how your relationship with God might have influenced that, what you feel, where you are currently at? Does it contradict some of your lifestyle choices? 


에이셉 라키: 전쟁이 일어나는 이유가 종교, 탐욕, 그런 것들이잖아요. 그래서 저는 종교를 그런 면에서 생각해요, 오늘까지도 종교로 인해 시작되는 테러 공격들이 있잖아요. 물론 어느 한 종교인이나 어떠한 종교를 탓하는 건 아니지만, 저는 조금 더 정신적인 가치를 갖고 살아가는 사람인 것 같아요. 모든 종교의 장점들만 뽑아와서 더 나은 제 자신을 만들려고 노력하고 있어요, 왜냐면 근본적으로 종교의 목적도 성장을 위한 거 아닌가요? 그렇다면 자신이 기독교라고 해서 그 믿음과 가치들을 갖고 적대감을 불러일으키는 건 틀린 거라고 생각해요. 당신은 욕을 하면 안 된다고 생각하는데 다른 사람은 괜찮다고 해서 그 상대방의 양심을 질문할 필요는 없다고 생각해요. 다른 사람들을 도와주고 잘못 알고 있는 걸 가르쳐주는 건 좋지만, 갑자기 “넌 결혼하기 전에 성관계를 가졌으니까 지옥에 갈 거야”라고 말하는 건 틀렸다는 거죠. 그 말이 맞는다면 여기 있는 분들도 얼음 좀 챙기셔야 할 거예요, 지옥은 뜨거우니까. 저는 모든 사람의 종교와 그들의 믿음을 존중해요, 다들 자신만의 생각이 있는 거고 인간으로서 그럴 권리가 있으니까요. 하지만 그걸 갖고 다른 사람들을 적대하는 건 틀렸다는 거예요. 저는 제가 일루미나티라고 단정 짓는 루머들도 들어봤는데 다 그냥 말도 안 되는 얘기들 같아요. 저는 그저 아티스트로서 제 자신을 표현하고 싶을 뿐이에요. 그게 다예요. 그래서 이 노래 Holy Ghost는 사람들에게 신경 끄라는 메시지를 주고 있는 거예요. 저는 매일 밤 기도를 해요. 교회를 다니지는 않지만 그런 종교적인 자질은 갖고 있어요. 쿠키를 먹기 전에도 기도를 해요, 1달러도 없어서 친구들에게 동전을 받아 모아서 쿠키를 사 먹어야 하던 시절을 생생히 기억하니까. 그리고 그렇게 간절히 원하던걸 얻었을 때, 은혜를 잊지 않고 감사함을 표현해야 하죠. 지금 이걸 듣고 있는 당신들에게는 우스운 얘기일 수도 있지만, 저는 신과 저만의 관계가 있는 거예요. 모든 가정, 모든 관계, 약혼을 한 사이든 가볍게 만나고 있든, 다 똑같은 거예요, 항상 복잡하죠. 그 둘의 관계 밖에서 누군가 들여다본다면 다들 미쳤다고 생각할 거예요. 저와 제 신의 관계도 마찬가지예요. 신경 끄세요, 그게 다예요.

I look at religion like one of those things where wars start over them. It’s over greed and religion and stuff like that. Even to this day, people to terrorist attacks and those are all religion driven. And I would never blame it on somebody religion or a certain type of religion. I feel like I’m more of a spiritual person. I take the best out of different religions and I try to make myself a better person because religions are all about bettering yourself, if I’m not mistaken. If that’s the case, I don’t think it’s right for you to be Christian and antagonize someone else with their religious beliefs. If someone feels that it’s okay to use the f-word and you don’t, I don’t think you should scrutinize. It’s okay to correct somebody and help somebody, but you got people straight up tell you “you’re going to hell because you’re not married and you’re having sex.” So with that being said, a lot of y’all should be having some ice packets because hell is hot. I respect everyone’s religion and their religious beliefs, everyone has an opinion as an individual and they’re entitled to it, but I don’t think it’s right to antagonize people just because you have religious beliefs. I’ve been accused of being Illuminati, it doesn’t make sense. I just want to be an artist and express myself. That’s it. That song Holy Ghost was telling people to back off. I pray every night, because I don’t go to church but I still carry those religious traits. I pray over my cookies, before I eat my cookies. I just can’t help it because I remember the times when I didn’t have a dollar and I used to have to ask my friends for quarters to get a cookie. And when you got it, you say your grace. And I say it sounds petty to you guys, but it’s complicated because I have my own relationship with god. Any marriage, any kind of relationship, rather you guys are engaged or going out, it’s always complicated. Anybody else on the outside looking in, they’re gonna think you’re crazy. That’s how I am with my lord. Mind your business, you know. 

 

[Holy Ghost]: 


Q: 대중들이 당신의 인생을 감시하고 비난하는 거를 신경 쓰시나요?

Do you care about public scrutiny over your life?


에이셉 라키: 어느 정도까지는 신경 쓰지 않죠. 

To an extent, I don’t. 


Q: 이제 인기 아티스트가 되셨으니 유명세가 아티스트로서의 표현력을 자제 시키거나 변화시키는 면이 있나 궁금해요

I wanted to ask you how you feel your artistic expression is limited or affected by the fact that you’re now a popular artist. 


에이셉 라키: 예전에는 다들 하고 싶은 얘기 다 하고 그냥 넘어갈 수 있는 시절이 있었죠. 요즘에는 인터넷이 있잖아요. 연예인이나 유명 스타와 일반인 사이에 그 다리는 이제 무너져 내려서 없어진 상태인 것 같아요. 이제 아무나, 아무것도 아닌 일로 유명해질 수 있어요. 킴 카다시안을 보세요. 유명한 백만장자이지만, 저는 아직까지도 그녀가 이쁜 거 말고 뭘 하는지 정확히 모르겠어요. 아무나 할 수 있는 거잖아요.

Anybody in the back in the days could say whatever they wanted and get away with it. Nowadays, the internet, man. The bridge between celebrity personality and being a normal person, that’s broken down. Anybody can become famous for nothing, you just need the internet. Look at Kim Kardashian, a multi-millionaire, and I don’t exactly know what she does other than look pretty. Anybody can do it.


Q: 인터넷 시대인 지금은 거의 모든  세계적으로 나아가잖아요에이셉 얌스의 영향력이 당신에게 어떤 변화를 가져다줬나요그리고 그에게서 받은 도움이 아직 유효한가요?

Especially in the internet age, where everything is very universal, how do you think Yams’ influence helped you? And do you take that forward? 


에이셉 라키: 인터넷. 그리고 그의 인맥. 아무도 에이셉 라키가 누군지 모를 때 그는 텀블러(Tumblr)를 활용해서 저를 대중에게 처음 소개해 줬고, 돈이 한 푼도 없을 때 그가 모으던 매거진들을 팔아서 스튜디오를 빌리곤 했었죠. 아티스트들에 대한 내용을 블로그에 올리곤 했었는데, 이미 인지도가 어느 정도 있는 분들 사이에 제 이름을 껴주고 그랬어요. 그 블로그를 누가 관리하는지는 저희가 유명해지고 1년이 지나서야 밝혀졌죠. 에이셉 얌스가 없었으면 지금의 에이셉 크루도 없었을 거예요. 아무도 그 중요성을 모를 때 그는 인터넷을 활용했고, 이제는 아이튠스 같은 스트리밍 서비스들이 존재하기 때문에 피지컬 앨범을 살 이유도 없어졌죠. 정말 슬픈 거이기도 한데, 음악은 10년마다 모든 것이 바뀌어요. 레코드플레이어에서부터 시작해서 카세트테이프, 그리고 CD 전에는 플로피 디스크가 있었죠. 그리고 CD 다음에는 이제 디지털 MP3가 생긴 거고요. 제가 인터넷을 활용해서 당신들이 원하는 거 아무거나 이룰 수 있다고 자신 있게 말할 수 있는 이유는 그 시장은 당신들이 필요하기 때문이에요. 이 세상에 천재들이 이끌어가야 할 부분이죠.

The internet. His connections. He utilized his Tumblr to put me out there. No one knew who A$AP Rocky was. He used to collect old source magazines and when we didn’t have money for studio time, we would sell them. He had all that stuff, and what he would do is make blogs about artists that were already relevant. He would put my name in there, because they didn’t know who he was. They didn’t know who was running his Tumblr after a year we got famous. If it wasn’t for A$AP Yams, there would be no A$AP right now. He used the internet at a time when we didn’t know that was the case. And with streaming services and iTunes, there’s no reason to go out and buy physical copies. And what’s really sad is music always changes by the decade. You start off with record players, cassette players, and before CD’s, what they would record on was floppy disks. Then CD’s, now you have digital mp3. The point of me being so firm about that and saying you can do whatever you want with the internet is because they’re gonna come for you. They need all the geniuses in the world to run that. 

 


Q: 처음부터 신기한 스타일을 갖고 나오셨고  과정에서 문화와 취향에 많은 영향을 주신  같아요그게 모두 계획된 것들이었나요아님 단순히 그런 옷들이 좋아서 입는 건가요?

Especially because you came out with this interesting aesthetics, I believe you influenced the taste and you influenced the culture. I wondered, is that an intentional thing? Or do you kind of wear these clothes because that’s what you like? 


에이셉 라키: 이제 10월이면 27살이 되고 저도 많이 늙었어요, 그런 것들 신경 안 써요. 클럽에 가도 너무 시끄럽고, 제가 좋아하는 음악이 나오지도 않고, 얼마 안 있다 나오게 돼요. 어쨌든 제 패션은 몇십 년간의 영향 아래 만들어지는 거 같아요. 처음 나왔을 때는 제가 많이 노출되지 않았었으니까 제 의상에도 마찬가지로 별로 관심 없었던 것 같아요. 변하긴 합니다만, 기본적으로는 그냥 제 미학인 것 같아요. 래퍼는 어떤 옷을 입어야 하죠? 이 질문에 여러분은 쉽게 대답을 하시겠죠: 헐렁한 청바지, 모자, 금목걸이, 맞죠? 근데 반대로 의사가 일을 하지 않을 때는 어떤 옷을 입나요? 변호사는요? 억만장자는? 저라는 사람을 래퍼라는 단어 하나로 정의 내리지 않으셨으면 해요, 왜냐면 저는 아티스트이거든요. 래퍼들은 랩을 하고, 아티스트들은 표현을 해요. 그게 차이점이에요.

Now, I’m getting old. I’ll be 27 in October, I don’t care about those stuff. i go to the clubs, and it’s too loud. They don’t play the music I like, and I leave after a while. That being said, my fashion sense stems from different decades. When I first came out, you didn’t get to see me as much in terms of my wardrobe changes. Does it evolve, yea, but it’s always been my aesthetic. What is a rapper supposed to dress like? You guys could easily answer that: baggy jeans, hat, gold chain, right? But what does a doctor dress like off duty? What does a lawyer dress like? What does a multi-billionaire dress like? I feel like I shouldn’t just be identified as a rapper because I’m not. I’m an artist. Rappers rap, artists articulate. That’s the difference.


Q: Dope이라는 영화와 연기에 도전하길 선택한 것에 대해  말씀해 주실  있을까요?

Could you talk about Dope and the choice to go into acting? 


에이셉 라키: 저는 아티스트에요. 연극, 영화 예술, 영상 제작, 영화. 그 영화 속에서 저는 26살 마약 밀매자 역할을 맡았어요. 서부에서 왔고, 이 캐릭터는 원래 범생이었지만 주변 환경에 의해 마약을 팔면서 살 수밖에 없는 사람이에요. 그리고 거리의 문화로 인해 깡패로 변해야만 했죠. 이 영화는 전체적으로 깡패들에게 쫓기는 범생이를 보면서 예전 자신의 모습을 회상하고 인종차별적인 단어의 현실을 보여주는 내용이에요. 지금 우리의 세대는 인종 차별주의자가 아니라, 그저 인종차별적인 얘기를 가끔 할 수 있는 사람들인 것 같아요. 저는 개인적을 그 “n” 단어를 사용해도 상관하지 않아요, 제 지인이라면. 하지만 대부분 그렇지 않죠. 이런 불편한 상황들을 이 영화가 보여주고, 그 거리를 탈출하고 싶어 하는 품격 있는 사람들이 충분히 있다는 걸 보여줘요.

I’m an artist. Theater, cinematography, videography, movies. I play as a cliche 26-year old drug dealer. Basically, I’m from the West Coast, and my character used to be a nerd and he ended up becoming a product of his environment and selling drugs. He had to become this gangster guy because that’s just the life in the streets. The story is based on this nerdy kid getting chased by those gangsters that’s retrospective and shows you the truth about the n-word. For our generation, we’re not racist, we’re just capable of saying some racist shit. For me, I don’t give a shit who uses it if you’re my friend. Some people aren’t like that. It’s an uncomfortable situation that the movie touches on, they need to show that there are elegant people in the hood and people who strive to get out.

 

[Dope Movie Trailer]:  


Q: 최근 미국에는 경찰과 소수 집단그리고 다른 인종 간에 많은 긴장감이 있어요래퍼들이 이런 사회적 문제에 대해 얘기하는  맞는다고 생각하세요아님 힙합 아티스트들이 관여할 문제가 아니라고 생각하세요?

There has been a lot of racial tension in America lately, especially between the police and the ethnic minorities. Do you think it’s in the place for rappers to talk about those issues or it’s not the place for hip hop artists to come in on that?


에이셉 라키: 아무도 그런 얘기를 해야 할 의무는 없는 것 같아요, 자기 자신이 하고 싶지 않은 이상. 모든 사람들이 켄드릭처럼 정치적인 얘기를 할 필요는 없다고 생각해요. 에이셉처럼 마약, 옷, 여자, 그리고 또 뭐가 있죠? 인종에 대해서 얘기하지 않아도 되는 것처럼. 우리 모두 같은 주제에 대해 얘기하지 않아도 돼요. 그리고 저는 그런 일들이 있을 때 그 자리에 없었어요. 더 중요한 건 저는 아무 행진에도, 시위에도 참여하지 않았어요. 이걸 바꾸기 위해 한 것이 아무것도 없으니 저는 이것에 대한 얘기를 할 수 없어요. 어느 날 스튜디오에서 쉬고 있었는데 제 매니저가 중요한 얘기를 하나 하더라고요. 미국 여기저기에서 보이고 있는 경찰의 잔혹성에 대해 얘기하고 있었는데, 이렇게 도시사회와 경찰들 간에 싸움을 극대화하면서 정부는 정말 무엇을 숨기고 싶어 하는 걸까? 지난 금요일이랑 토요일, 60 몇 명이 총에 맞았어요, 시카고에서. 흑인 대 흑인 범죄였죠. 근데 경찰관 한 명이 흑인을 쏘면 행진을 하고, 시위를 하고, 믹스테이프를 통해서 홍보를 하고, 많은 것들을 하죠. 정말 근본적인 주제에 대해 얘기하지 않을 거면, 아예 얘기하지 않는 게 나은 것 같아요. 우리가 제일 먼저 해야 하는 건 저희 스스로, 내적으로 해야 하는 일들 같아요. 모든 경찰들을 탓할 수도 없어요, 어쩔 수 없이, 피할 수 없는 일들이 있으니. 경찰들이 아이들을 죽이는 건 당연히 문제라고 생각해요, 분명 죄가 있는 경찰들이 있는 것도 알아요. 자신의 권한을 무기로 삼는 경찰들도 있지만, 그건 새로운 소식이 아니잖아요. 왜 지금? 진짜 숨기고 있는 건 뭔데? 그거에 대해 얘기하려면 흑인이 흑인을 죽이는 것부터 얘기해야죠.

I don’t feel like anybody is obligated to talk about that kind of stuff unless they want to. I don’t think everyone should be like Kendrick and talk about political things just to stand out. They don’t have to be like A$AP and talk about drugs, clothes, and girls. And religion, and stuff. We don’t have to talk about the same topics. I wasn’t there when that occurred, and on top of that, I didn’t go to any marches, i didn’t go to any protests. So for me, I can’t speak on that because I’m not helping to change it. My manager brought up a crazy point to me when we were all at the studio chilling and we were speaking about the police brutality going on in Baltimore and everywhere in America. It makes you think, what is the government really trying to hide because why are we exploiting the beef between the urban community and police officers when in reality, 60 something people got shot on a Friday and Saturday, in 1 city in Chicago. Black on black crime. So one cop shoots a black person. Let’s march, let’s protest, let’s promote our mixtapes on TV, let’s do all that. That’s what they’re doing. I feel like if you’re not going to talk about the main topic, don’t talk about it at all. We have to do something first, and that’s within us internally. We can’t blame the police officers, that kind of shit is inevitable. I don’t justify cops killing kids, that’s so messed up, because there are guilty cops out there. There are cops that take advantage of their authority, but that’s nothing new. Why now? What are we really hiding? If we’re going to  talk about that, let’s talk about black people killing black people. 


Q: 힙합은 역사적으로 예술에 영향을 많이   문화였어요요즘은 힙합이 문화에 주는 영향력을 사람들이  알아주는  같으세요그리고 에이셉은 힙합을 하는 사람의 정의를 어떻게 바꿔놨나요?

Hip hop has been historically a subculture which had a lot of influence on art. Do you feel like there’s a lot more credit being given to the influence hip hop has had on culture more broadly? And how did A$AP influence what it means to be a man in hip hop?


에이셉 라키: 어떤 환경이든 똑같은 것 같아요. 제가 소호에 자주 다니는 평범한 아이였을 때 얘기를 하자면, 항상 너무 비싸서 살 수 없었던 스키니진을 입고 다녔어요. 아메리칸 어패럴에 갔었죠. 저 말고 에이셉에 있는 다른 친구들이요. 아메리칸 어패럴에 가서, 가장 큰 사이즈의 여성 청바지를 샀었어요. 그래야 스키니진처럼 입을 수 있었거든요. 그게 바로 패션을 만드는 과정이에요. 2006년도에 스키니진을 입고 돌아다니는 건 지금 이마에 빨간색 점이 있는 타깃을 그려놓고 다니는 거랑 마찬가지인 거 같아요. 저희는 친구들 사이에서의 타깃이 되었고, 형들한테 맞았던 기억이 나네요. 저는 엄마 뱃속에서 나왔을 때부터 여자만 밝히는 사람이었어요, 그러니 저보다 덩치 큰 형들에 맞서 싸우려고 했을 때 당연히 졌죠. 근데 얻어 맞고 집에 걸어가던 그날 저희는 자부심이 넘쳤었어요. 최선을 다했고, 그거만으로 자부심을 느꼈죠. 하루의 끝에는 저희 모습 그대로 길을 걷고 있었고, 그날 깨달은 건 아티스트로서, 래퍼로서 어떤 업적을 남기고 싶다면 앞으로도 이런 싸움을 많이 하겠구나 생각했어요.

I think that goes with any environment. I feel like when I talk about my life being a normal kid going to So-Ho, we used to wear skinny jeans that we couldn’t afford. We used to go to American Apparel. Not me, but some of the homies in A$AP. They would go to American Apparel and buy women’s jeans bigger just so they could get the skinny fit because you couldn’t get skinny jeans back then. That’s identifying fashion. I feel like wearing skinny jeans back in 2006 was like walking around with a target on your forehead with a red dot in the middle. We were targets for kids our age, and I remember we got our asses whipped by the older guys. I was like 19 or 20, we were young. Ever since I came out of my mom, I’ve been a lady’s man so when I was young, walking past guys to call you a faggot, that’s just beyond disrespectful. We tried to fight them, they was bigger, we lost. But we walked home with pride. We tried our best and left with our pride. At the end of the day, we walked the way we did and the lesson that I learned from that night is that if I ever wanted to pursue anything as far as becoming an artist or rapper or whatever you call it, that meant I would have to do a lot of that fighting.


Q: 저는 힙합 음악을 즐겨 듣지만 가끔 여성을 모욕하는 내용이 있을 때마다 실망해요당신의 음악도 남성에 비해 여성을 많이 차별한다고 생각하세요?

There is a downside for me in that a lot of the music is quite crude about women and sometimes insulting, but do you think that your music isolates women and prevents us from listening to your music compared to men? 


에이셉 라키: 가끔 그렇죠. 

At times. 


Q: 가끔이요그리고 그게 괜찮다고 생각하세요

At times? And do you think that’s okay?


에이셉 라키: 왜냐면 남자들한테도 그러니까요. “난 너희 흑인들이랑 안 어울 려,” 혹은 “남자들 다 꺼져”라는 가사를 얼마나 자주 들어보셨어요? 항상 남자들을 디스 해요. 여성과 여성인권, 이런 얘기를 하는 건가요?

Because I do it to men too. How many songs you hear “I don’t fuck with you n-ggas,” and “fuck you dudes.” We diss men all the time. Is this about women and justice and everything? 


Q: 아니요저도 당신의 음악을 좋아해요그래도 가끔 가사와 동의하지 않는데 계속 들어야 하나 고민할 때가 있어요.

No, I really enjoy your music. But sometimes I wonder if I should still listen to it if I don’t agree with it. 


에이셉 라키: 그건 스스로만 답할 수 있는 질문이겠네요. 다른 래퍼들은 모르겠고 제 얘기만 하자면, 저는 제 경험에 대해서만 얘기해요. 저는 나쁜 여자들과 여성에 차이점에 대해 얘기하러 여기 온 게 아니고, 음악을 만들 때는 그냥 표현을 할 뿐이에요. 저는 26살이고 그동안 많은 여성분들도 만났었고, 마찬가지로 나쁜 여자들도 많이 만났었어요.

That’s a question that only you can answer. Without justifying all those rappers, speaking for me, I only speak about my experiences. At the end of the day, I’m not here to talk about the difference between bitches and women. When we make music, we articulate. I’m 26, I met a lot of women, and I met a lot of bitches. 


Q: 많은 사람들과 어울리면서 런던에서 녹음을 하셨다고 했잖아요영국의 힙합 시장과 그라임 장르에 대해 어떻게 생각하세요

You spoke about recording in London and how you were chilling with a lot of people. What do you think about the grime scene or the UK hip hop scene? 


에이셉 라키: 그라임은 정말 놀라운 것 같아요. 저는 90년대 힙합은 갱스터 랩뿐만 아니라 캐리비언, 자메이카 아티스트들도 다 포함되어 있다고 생각해요. 미국 스타일의 비트 위해 자메이카 억양으로 랩하면서 아예 소 장르를 따로 만들었다고 생각해요. 그리고 그 시절과 비슷한 느낌이 지금 영국에서 똑같이 느껴져요. 계속 맞는 방향으로 간다면, 미국의 힙합 시장까지도 닿을 수 있다고 생각해요.

I think grime is amazing. For me, ‘90s hiphop had gangster rap but it also had Caribbean, Jamaican rap artists. You had all these guys that used American beats but used Jamaican accents that made this sub-genre of rap. And I feel like that spirit lives within the UK scene right now. If they do it the right way, it can cross all the way to hip hop in the States because people don’t know about it too much. 


Q: 당신의 배경이 음악에 어떤 영향을 주었고 앞으로 시위에 어떻게 참여하실지 궁금해요아까 하신 답변에 동의하지 않는데그래도 당신의 배경이 어떤 방식으로 음악에 영향을 주는지에 대해 듣고 싶네요.

I would like you to speak about how your community has affected your music and moving forward place yourself in the world of protest. I disagreed with your previous answer, but I would like to hear about how your community still comes out in your music. 


에이셉 라키: 할렘. 거기는 이제 더 이상 흑인들이 살지 않아요. 그리고 거기 살던 사람들은 이제 성공한 분들이고 중산층에 속해있죠. 그래서 할렘이 어떤 식으로 영향을 줬는지는 말 못 하겠지만, 런던에서 1년을 보낸 에이셉 라키로서 제가 보지 못한 일들에 대해 얘기 못해요. 저는 제 자신이 편하고, 그냥 제 인생이에요. 제 음악을 통해 다른 라이프스타일을 갖은 사람들의 얘기를 하지만, 그거만 갖고 제가 어떤 사람인지 단정 지으면 안 돼요. 그래서 제 음악은 무엇보다 자유롭길 바라요. 제가 어디서 왔고 얼마나 힘들었는지에 대해 말하면 뭐가 달라지나요? 그런 얘기는 다른 래퍼들도 다 똑같이 하잖아요. 저는 지금 예술을 하고 있고, 제 세대와 제 시대를 사랑해요. 근데 저는 변화를 만들기 위해 그 어떤 노력도 하지 않았기 때문에 그거에 대한 얘기를 할 자격도 없어요. TV 속에서 본 것들, 내가 자라온 곳이 재개발되며 국가를 갈라놓는 일. 너한테도 상관없는 일이고 나도 전혀 신경 쓰지 않아.

Harlem. There’s really no black people left. All the people that lived there is successful middle class or upper class people. So I can’t tell you about how Harlem relates, but as A$AP Rocky who spent the year in London, I can’t talk about something if I wasn’t there for it. I’m comfortable with being myself, that’s my life. I speak for those kids who have that lifestyle but it doesn’t define me. That’s why my music wants to be free. What’s the point of me talking about where I came from and how hard it was for me when every rapper is talking about the same? I’m doing art right now, I like where life is going, I love my generation and my era. But the reason why I can’t talk about that is because I didn’t contribute to help to make a difference. I see things on TV, gentrification split the nation that I once was raised in. You should never give a damn and I don’t give a fuck entirely. 

 

-- 

[Interview by]: Oxford Union

[Translation by]: HIPHOPPLAYA 이승연 (lsy@hiphopplaya.com) 

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